THE IRISH RED AND WHITE SETTER

A Process of Reconstruction

Article published in Our Dogs 1983

by

Gilbert Leighton Boyce

It is clear from a reference that I have found in Thornhill’s rare book of 1804 that the “red and white” setters and the “all red” setters existed side by side in Ireland at the end of the eighteenth century. He went there for shooting and found both well favoured

Some of use would have found it more logical to call the parti-coloured ones “white and red” because as the Irish Kennel Club standard says, “the base colour should be white with solid red patches”; but in deciding upon “red and white” as the way round for the name the Club seems to have older precedents on its side.

 Besides stating that the dog “must be clearly parti-coloured” the standard is also at pains to avoid any tendency to colouration in some English setters; it goes on “Mottling or flecking but not roaning is permitted around the face and feet and up the foreleg as far as the elbow, and up the hind legs as far as the hock”

It is well known that the Irish setters contributed to the development of the English setters, as did the Black and Tan, so there should be no surprise that the two sorts of Irish should have been crossed with each other from time to time By 1903 we find J.H.H.Swiney writing that of the red and white “now there are but few kennels left”. Although a specialist in the reds he wrote very favourably of the red and whites, and he envisaged that by making use of the puppies (usually one or two per litter in his day) which had more white than the red standard allowed, “it would not be difficult , were it desirable, to again establish the red and white setter as a distinct breed”.

Crossing in fact continued among the working setters of Ireland, quite apart from the few continuing red and white specialists, and this is how it is that a setter with a basic white coat can be produced from parents who are red with minor white markings but Carry some colour instability in their genetic make-up. This has been done in England, and I believe in Scotland in Mr Kerr’s Rushfield kennel, as well as in Ireland in the fairly recent past. Looking further back, W.J.Rasbridge noted in Our Dogs of Nov 5,1954 a red litter which included “several puppies with tails white from root to tip and with large areas of white over the loins and haunches” and had all grandparents show winners (two of them Champions and one a Show Champion): but it is among the field trial and working strains that this phenomenon has occurred most frequently.

The presumption is that there is more red and white breeding close behind some of them than there is elsewhere in red setters (and possibly in a few some connection with other material making colour inheritance less stable). By careful selection it has been possible from these sources to produce breeding material with which to refresh the surviving red and white stock which had fallen in the nineteen fifties and sixties to an all time low, indeed but for the Cuddy “Knockalla family in Co Cork and a few of their friends, we might have lost all prospect of success.

The weaving in of the mixed material has been a delicate operation requiring rigorous selection, and it has been carried out successfully with the advice of those most experienced of whom it is fitting to mention particularly Mr John Nash of “Moanruad” fame. An effort has been made to avoid bringing in non-working lines as far as possible, because the essence of the red and white apart from the colour difference is that is it a less streamlined setter than the modern show reds, dare I say a more workaday sort of animal. The interim standard stresses “strength” and calls for a head “broad in proportion to the body” and the skull to have no “occipital protuberance”, no doubt with this in mind. It also allows a “hazel” as sdistinct from “dark hazel” eye.

So much for the past. For analysis of what we now have to work on in England and Wales I take 20 “source” animals, 18 imported from Ireland and two born here from working stock. I find that there are two direct male lines involved and seven direct female families of which four may link together further back than they can at present be traced with any confidence.

The first of the two male lines comes from Waydown Sandy. To this line belongs Mr “Shannonlee” Webb’s Beaulah and Boreen of Ardnagashel, Miss”Meiklered” Fletcher’s Brisket and Mrs “Sancris” Morrison’s Bonfire of Ardnagashel, all from Mrs Kaulback. In the same line is the leading show dog here, Mr Webb’s Meudon Amber Glow, Mrs Hunton-Girling’s Meudon Minstrel of  Sarelle, Mr and Mrs Baron’s Meudon Gay Princess, Mrs Knox’s Meudon Lady of Coolfin (Meudon being the affix of Mr and Mrs Gormley of Swords, Co Dublin who gave the revival such a grand send off over here by being the first to show a red and white at Crufts for so many years, the striking dog Harlequin of Knockalla). Also in the same line are Miss “Bawnrhu” Somerfield’s Heather, Glenkeen Shane and Flight of Almanor (born in Norfolk of part Irish stock); and a new import by Mrs Brigden, Whistle Down the Wind of Autumnwood. Waydown Sandy had the misfortune for so important a dog to have his breeding incorrectly recorded. It is now widely accepted that the version given no doubt in good faith to our KCSB may best be ignored. His sire, one of many dogs called “Shot”,  was probably by Jeremy of Knockalla out of Felicity of Knockalla, which would link him with many of the most successful red and whites of the inter-war era. Over his dam I am afraid that I have still no clear information. Line breeding to several of Sandy’s sons and one famous daughter has had a great influence.

The other male line is through Int FTCh Ballymac Eagle to his paternal grandsire Spinner’s brother (1944) who was by Prince, who was by Ruby, an unusual name for a male. In this line comes Miss Fletcher’s Winnowing Gannet and Goldfinch, bred by Mar Dermot Mooney who has done so much for the breed in Ireland (Goldfinch, now with Mr Webb, is dam of Shannonlee Majestic Flame, so far, Amber Glow’s most successful son). Brosna Grouse and Judy of Autumnwood (the dog now with Mesdames Perriam and Roberts) and the field trial winner Juno Assarts, born in South London of Irish stock, which Mr and Mrs Truman registered as a red, as they were entitled to do as both her parents are in that register (although she is very much a particolour). Miss Somerfield’s prince of Dublin and Patricai, and Meudon Modern Millie of Sarelle. Ironically, if Waydown Sandy’s official sire were right, we would have only one male line., because he was Grudy, a son of Spinner’s Brother.

The female families are more diverse and in some cases better documented. Heather, alone of the 20, can be traced fully back through the Sulhamstead and Menaifron kennels all the way back to LooVII who was born  as long ago as 1880. She was a red with white on the chest and hind toes. Flight of Almanor goes back through John Nash’s great Int FTCH New Square Red Lassie of Milltown. Juno Assarts, Glenkeen Shane, and Whistle Down the Wind of Autumnwood go back to Waydown Sandy’s daughter Int FTCh Patricia of Killone (also John Nash’s) and through her to Int FTCh Rahard Belle and so eventually to the mating of Hartsbourne Gerald with an obscure bitch Sheevra Og long thought to have no known parents, but I have recently found them given as Connaught Hero and Western Flow. Prince of Dublin and Patricia derive from Canon Doherty’s Judy who was a daughter of Rita, who may or may not link with the other families not traceable very far back but reputedly connecting with other earlier red and white breeding.

Winnowing Goldfinch and Gannet derive through Tristar from Sherry Second, who I believe to be a good source. The four Ardnagashel bitches come from Gaynor’s Duchess whose dam is sometimes given  as Vixen because she belonged to a Mr Fox. She is said to have been closely related to one of Waydown Sandy’s parents, if not both.  The remaining seven of my twenty, Meudon and Brosna, all derive from McMahon’s Shot Second (Shot being a name used for either sex) whose dam Shot First was out of a bitch belonging to Mr Pat Naylan. If this note catches the eye of anyone who can throw light on any of the female families which I have not extended, I would be very grateful for any information.

From these beginnings there is, in my view, sufficient scope for a full scale reconstruction, but counting puppies the population in England and Wales must be into three figures already and I hope that care will be exercised. Breeders should of course be looking for quality and for temperament, rigorously discarding puppies and young stock faulty in conformation or colour. There are enough good ones around for there to be no need for the extreme in-breeding which has led to problems with some other rare breeds. I do not favour any further recourse to mixed breedings with reds. Experiments of that sort should only take place if there is evidence of some persistent fault which cannot otherwise be eradicated. I do not see one at the present. The improper body flecking in some stock can be eliminated by recourse to other existing stock  which does not exhibit this tendency. There do seem, however to be two different types emerging, which occur sometimes in the same litter, so full stability has not yet been achieved. I refer to the solid bodied, heavy boned type which resembles the early 19^th century paintings of red and whites, and which is I think what the interim standard looks towards, and a much lighter boned type, a beautiful free moving animal , often a shade smaller in scale. I find them both fascinating, but sooner or later breeders will have collectively to make a rather awkward choice

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Before he wrote this article, Gilbert Leighton-Boyce had been corresponding with Terry O'Leary, who supplied him with some of the pedigrees and photographs. Here is one of the letters written to Terry

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